Long time lurker of the forum. Started an account recently since I would like to engage more with a community I can resonate with.
What mobile OS do you use?
Do you use multiple devices for personal and work?
What did you have to give up in your pursuit for privacy & security?
What are the annoyances in using Custom ROMs?
I have used both iOS & Android. Lately I have been switching back and forth between my iOS (iphone 13 mini) and an Pixel 6A (custom OS) for my personal devices. I am using the iphone for the most part primarily because of the size but I know there will come a time when that iPhone will be unsupported and a device of such size is no longer available. P6A, although large, is a great device and I’m loving the custom ROM experience. Once I am home and if I have to look up something I have been testing out 6A for minor tasks (browsing, reading and trying different apps). I tried using P6A solely last year but handling the phone became hard and switched back to iPhone. I don’t quite enjoy the iOS UI and absolutely hate the keyboard. Apple’s walled garden is suffocating and I loathe their business practices. I am aware phones are not going to get any smaller and some day or the other I will have to get used to it. Might as well get used to larger phone sizes sooner than later. I have been thinking of selling the iphone 13 mini and stick to just the Pixel, which as far as I know will get updates till 2027.
What would be a good strategy here? I much prefer the Android OS over iOS but reluctantly sticking to the latter only for the size. I don’t really use a lot of apps. Staying away from Android only for the size. I have another work provided iOS device which is a large one too. Not a big fan of the Android caller screen but I can live with that.
Is there an open source dialer I can use in Android? Is there a better alternative to Simple Mobile Apps? I understand that they have been bought by an Adware firm and was wondering what’s a user friendly alternative is?
Lots of reasonable (and relatable) things in your post! As nice as having two phones can be for certain configurations, it can be a hassle at times!
If you’re committed to trying just an Android-only workflow, why don’t you set up your Android device as a daily driver and put the iPhone in your drawer for a week to see how you enjoy an Android-only workflow? You won’t fully know what you like/dislike until you fully use it. From there you can make a decision if you can sell one of the phones, keep both, or another workflow.
This is personal preference, but something I both loved and despised about Android is the massive flexibility it offers. On one hand it enables some of the fantastic tools we love and adore in the community. On the other hand it makes configuring & maintaining my phone a bit more of a chore than a phone that takes care of everything (like iOS does for many).
The screen size is also a very real thing, especially if you’re used to the mini which is significantly smaller than everything else on the market right now. People really lose sight of how large even base model phones are until you compare side by side:
(the 8a isn’t even a very large Android phone!)
I was using iPhone for a long time then switched to Android with Pixel 6 (Custom ROM). With the flexibility Android offers, I can´t see myself going back to iOS anytime soon.
On the other hand, needing to upgrade, I am having a dilemma about keep using custom ROM (with sandboxed play services) or switch to stock. For now, it works for my need but I keep asking myself what am I missing and for how long will my Apps keep working (had opened a discussion about it: Future of cutom ROMs)
I was quiet surprised setting up the new phone (Pixel) for the first time and I saw Google allowing me to choose my default browser and Search Engine.
iOS and Android.
Yes, and no.
I use an iPhone SE as my “private” phone and only my immediate family currently have the number.
I use a cheap up to date Samsung as a “public” phone, which includes work. Mostly because it’s the only non-Chinese option with decent local support. Nokia being the only other realistic option but comes with a +6 month release date delay.
I don’t use customer ROM’s, but the ones that come recommended also aren’t really supported on local devices.
I don’t really think in terms where I’ve given up anything for privacy or security. The main thing is the cost of keeping devices up to date when they have limited support life.
Migrating certain apps to desktop browsers or deleting accounts I’ve stopped using is pretty much the worst of it.
The SE has lock-down mode enabled and links to the things I care about in my personal life. It was originally my only phone, but due to a short series of events, it ended up with a phone number known only to my immediate family and friends. It’s still the one with social media on it, but otherwise I’ve effectively isolated my more private things in life on a more secure system.
The Samsung connects to work and other more public things. My only real gripe is not being able to uninstall everything and have a truly blank slate.
This has a few other minor advantages.
I don’t personally value anything on the Samsung. If it were to get lost or stolen the only cost would be the inconvenience of getting the same number on a new phone and the cost to my wallet. (Assuming they won’t be able to unlock it before I reset my emails).
Splitting screen use between the two also now means that the SE can last two days on a full charge and the Samsung 3 days. With scheduled battery saver the Samsung battery life estimate is actually currently at 4 days.
iOS because it is a good balance of privacy and convenience. I use websites over apps as much as possible and limit permissions of the apps that I do use.
I do also have a Pixel running GrapheneOS as a second phone, but I feel like it still requires too many sacrifices for me to give up the iPhone as my primary.
Thanks Henry for the input. You’re correct. I’m going to switch the SIMs this week and try it out. I remember when I used a custom ROM in a Pixel the first time it was, like you said, a chore setting up. Some of the apps gave me a hard time and I just couldn’t get into the workflow and the size was annoying. But once I switched to the iPhone I started using the Android mostly at home for all the mundane and mindless tasks and it gradually grew on me. I still don’t like the size I tell you but I think I can live with it. I have used non-Pixel Android phones in the past with custom ROMs and I survived. Not sure if the design of the earlier pixel has something to do with the inconvenience.
I have weaned myself off using mobile devices for banking and do it only on PCs these days. I miss the vast variety of tools available in Android, like Syncthing which I badly missed in iOS. I am aware there are alternatives in iOS but I have found it not user-friendly.
I have listened to you, I"m not sure, it either has to be Techlore talks or Surveillance Podcast about how phones are getting larger and how there is a dearth of small phones and I totally agree with your views in that regard. I was counting on Pixel 9 being “small” but last I check it is still bordering on 6"+ and that sucks.
I totally get where you are coming from. I have used iOS exclusively for work since the last 8 years and have used iOS devices for personal use as well. As much as polished the apps are, I just don’t use that many apps. I always do look for a web app, wherever possible.
Hands down, they have the best hardware. The caveats that make me want to switch - the keyboard and some ethical concerns regarding their business practices. That they are a good balance of privacy and convenience, I agree. My partner has exclusively uses iOS as her personal device and is never going to switch to a different OS but based on my recommendation she has switched to using Brave Browser, a VPN, DNS & Signal, which I would call a win.
I use iOS. The specific combination of privacy, security, and convenience fits my use case nearly perfectly.
Lockdown mode, ADP, iCloud Private relay, and easy system wide ad/tracker blocking with NextDNS is really hard to beat as an easy to use privacy/security package.
I travel a lot for work and personal reasons both domestically and internationally. My phone is often the only computing device I take with me (and definitely the only personal one, sometimes need the work laptop). I need the convenience and reliability of a mainstream device so while I remain curious about custom Android ROMs the potential for a serious technical issue when in Tokyo for 10 days is not something I want to deal with.
Also as a MacOS user, having an iPhone has great ecosystem advantages.
Tbh, I have been thinking something along the same lines about the longevity of the ROMs. I personally think they are here to last but a mass adoption is less likely. It works for all of my needs now but it doesn’t have to be the same way when a life event happens or your work/personal situation changes that would demand having a particular app in your phone. If that app requires Play Services or iOS, that is where I will have to start reconsidering. I know sandboxed Play Services or microg works just fine but I’m afraid somewhere down the road this will change or at least compromise apps to the point that one will be forced to switch to a generic OS. At least for the time being I’m going to try and stick to a custom and see where it takes me. I spent a good amount of time over the past few months tweaking everything to my liking and convenience and depending how that goes, I will decide if I have to keep the iOS or sell it.
This, I understand. When I travel for work, I almost always only take my work device with me which is an iOS and the convenience is unbeatable. Everything is flawless and I don’t have to tinker with anything while I’m on the road or between flights. What do you use for system wide ad/tracker blocking? May I ask Adguard, NextDNS or anything?
I’m not a Mac user and use Linux but I understand the ecosystem advantages make a lot of things easier and I see that as something inevitable when one has a family which is why I’m open to it sometime in the future while I explore the possibilities of a custom ROM.
I grapple with this every time I think about purchasing any electronic devices. The cost of devices makes me question the purchase and I have stuck to buying only used. Every device until recently only had a limited life. Samsung, Google and iPhone have chosen to stick to a decent update cycle. However, I still think to myself if a phone works I would like to keep using it until it bites the dust. When it no longer receives updates, I would move most of my apps and use of services to a desktop and use the phone for what it is - calling, texting and maps. I have used a previous iOS device and an Android the same away and had to upgrade eventually because it started interfering with day-to-day life. I understand this is not feasible for someone with a higher threat model. If I have to do this again, I would do it. I’m only trying to get away from tech surveillance and ad tracking.
tbf, Google’s custodianship of Android does raise valid concerns, but I find Android’s security posture to be much more assuring than iOS’. The Android Platform Security Model (2023) (mirror).
Thank you for your work on a great open source project!
I’m generally of the opinion that mainstream OS’s can become more or less equivalent in security and privacy depending on how much work you want to put in.
I already like my iPhone so having E2EE backups and the battle-tested Lockdown mode gave me easy ways to increase security and privacy. You can get the same end result on Android but will take a bit more work to set up.
Or at least a bit more work for me who last owned an Android phone more than a decade ago and am not familiar with it anymore.
Android, android, android. Sometimes IOS. I know I am biased.
Sadly, I have a Samsung phone. I got an Samsung before I got into privacy. I am stuck with my carrier for the next 1 1/2 year because I got the locked A15.
I have done major de-googling and “de-samsunging” (If that is even a term?!) on it through ADB. I so far have removed about 130 apps that are just not needed for my use case. I don’t have Google Play Services at all on my phone. 90% of the apps I use are open source from F-Droid.
I also have an Samsung Tablet, which I flashed my own custom Android kernel on it and have rooted it to completely remove all the Google crap and most of the Samsung crap. I also utilize a local firewall (AFwall+) that modifies iptables to block internet on a per-app basis. I also utilze Tailscale with Mullvad on both devices along NextDNS. I primarily use my tablet as I find it to be more private.
I plan on getting a Pixel and flashing Graphene OS in the future.
Despite arguable technical advantages I think something a lot of people miss is the accessibly of other tools on the platform. Android has the selling point of many wonderful tools we adore (like the one you develop, a proper Tor Browser, Briar, Signal forks, etc.) and some incredible features like work profiles and user accounts. But what iOS offers is a very convenient hardening mode (lockdown) and my personal favorite: Advanced data protection.
I’d love to see a seamless, OS-integrated ability to end-to-end encrypt most data points natively in a manner that’s accessible to most users (basic switch). The closest I could get to this on Android right now is downloading the Proton suite to my phone.
Anecdotally, the security differences between Android and iOS seem to swing back and forth depending on what people are comparing and at what point in time we’re in, but the features people can utilize on each platform tend to make a more consistent difference for the average end user in my experience. And if that’s what people are considering then it comes down to personal preference of what kinds of tools they’re using to improve their security and privacy.
If I am not mistaken, Pixel had this. Google One VPN was a well-thought out design.
These days, Google (along with Mozilla and Cloudflare) is busy pushing the OHAI (Oblivious HTTP Application Intermediation) standard that would make ALL HTTP connections anonymous (as in Tor) but with a latency/efficiency trade-off.
Though, I agree that no one understands and executes on “seamless integration” like Apple does. They’re way beyond everybody, even the ones who can actually compete with them (Google, Amazon, Samsung).
Initiatives like OSOM didn’t take off, unfortunately (see also: UP Phone, Iode, e/OS). Proton did show up with their own fork of Android; let’s see if they take the leap and launch a device or partner with CalyxOS!
I’ve also been nerd-sniping Chirayu Desai, the lead at CalyxOS, to launch CalyxOS+Pixel with deeper integration with privacy-respecting apps, but the budget (esp in rallying multiple FOSS projects towards a common goal) simply isn’t there.
Personally, I find Android to have a way better foundation for security (because I understand AOSP better and because it is subject to a LOT more scrutiny due its open nature), but not many know what’s inside iOS. Not long ago was Apple embarrassed by discovery of a silly 0-day (which is in fact alleged to be a backdoor). No amount of “lockdown mode” is going to protect against deliberate holes like those.
Maybe I wasn’t clear enough, because I think we’re referring to different things, either way Goolge One was sadly discontinued. (Internet gasp at Google discontinuing something)
What I’m specifically referring to is Apple’ss Advanced Data Protection which adds E2EE to iCloud Backup, Photos, Notes, and more within iCloud. This means the native suite most users will use on their phone gains E2EE for critical functionality where users traditionally had to choose between handing over their data to the first party or utilize E2EE third-parties for every part of their workflow.
What could dramatically improve this situation is if Google rolled out E2EE for more products in their suite so users can opt to use safer default tools on their devices. This probably isn’t the most popular suggestion in a community where people are likely inclined to move away from Google altogether, but I would argue that having E2EE as a simple toggle on an Android device for most of the Google suite would instantly boost the security of Android users overnight. With little-to-no drawback in daily usability.
Proton is definitely in a unique position where they already have many E2EE services that could eventually compete against iCloud/Google. If they were able to integrate their tools deeply into the system it’d be an awesome way to compete against a feature like ADP on iOS!
This would be awesome to see. Love the work he’s been doing there and he’s done so much for the community!
I am just on iOS at the moment using an iPhone XR that I purchased refurbished. Switched from Android around 3 years ago when my Android was giving up on me. I do prefer iOS but that doesn’t mean I necessarily “like” it if that makes sense, more of a lesser of two evils for me. Not being able to install any software from anywhere is probably the most annoying part but all of the conveniences of a more private OS compared to Android tend to outweigh that for me, since I am using iCloud with ADP to back my phone and photos up.
I also use Siri regularly, especially when driving where it is safer to be using a voice assistant rather than poking at your phone while driving which people really shouldn’t do. That would be presumably more private than using Google Assistant (or is it Gemini now? Who knows).
There’s also a number of other reasons, mostly just revolving around stuff like maps and other proprietary options being better on Apple than Google IMO, but I could be here all day .
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